What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Are you new to this way of life? Does terminology confuse you? Have you heard lots of horror stories that frighten you? This is the place to ask questions about terminology, meanings of words, and more.<P>Only Residents and higher may post here.

Moderators: jochanaan, MatthewNeal, jimmy, natman, Senior Moderator, Moderators

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby bn2bnude » Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:29 pm

I've been around and watching long enough that I don't know if I would hope for general acceptance.

There are too many leaders who, as a friend of mine says, are biblically illiterate. I know that sounds radical but that is exactly what the Biblical Naturist is combatting.

What I would hope to see is the evolution that is occurring with regards to alcohol in the evangelical church in general.

40-50 years ago, evangelicals were generally against alcohol use/enjoyment. I've heard several of the newer evangelical pastors who have preached sermons on a proper perspective. John Piper, in this example, seems to have softened his view

I think societal influences will still bear down on many, especially Christians, to not allow them to enjoy recreational nudity. Just think about the percentage of the population that don't consider themselves Christian who would have no religious objection but still have no desire to participate.

I do think, however, the Church in general should
  1. Learn what the Bible really says about nudity in general but recreational nudity in particular.
  2. Stop imposing a stereotyped view of recreational nudity derived from their "Hollywood/Playboy" imaginations and learn what the standards we (both AANR and Christian naturists) adhere to.
  3. Give grace to those who choose to participate.
So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. (Rom 8:1 NLT)



If I speak with the tongues of men and angels but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. (1 Cor 13:1)
User avatar
bn2bnude
Native Resident
 
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2006 8:09 am
Location: Denver

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby pipermac » Sun Dec 29, 2013 4:59 pm

Sex and Sexuality:
Since I opened the topic of sex and sexuality, I believe the best thing I can do is to explain what I mean by these two terms, since a dictionary-definition doesn't capture the fullness and richness of either word.

Sex:
Sex, in its most basic form, is our gender, normally either male or female. Our sex is determined by our unique genetic code, our DNA, which is imprinted into every cell in our body. Our physical sex is the outward, visible manifestation of what is in our DNA. Under normal circumstances, a person with male DNA will male "equipment", while a person with female DNA will have female "equipment". This genetic coding even determines how our brain is "wired", which is why men and women DON'T think alike. Even a person without visible genitals still has a genetic gender(sex).

We also use the term "sex" to denote the sexual interactions between two people. That is where the topic of "sex" can become quite sticky, because everyone has their own ideas of what is good and right, and what is inappropriate or bad. I am not going to delve into that part of the discussion.

Sexuality:
Our "sexuality" is how our sex(gender) affects every part of our lives. Our sexuality is initially determined by our visible gender. The first three words out of someone's mouth when a baby is born are either "It's a boy", or "It's a girl". The visible gender of the baby will be used to help determine whether that child is given a masculine name or a feminine name. Occasionally there are parents who "misname" a child, not following the child's gender, but those are fairly rare. Some parents choose gender-neutral names. Usually clothing is coordinated to match the child's gender, blue for boys, and pink for girls. Even the toys they are given to play with are gender-specific. This is just the beginning of a lifetime of gender-specific events and choices in a person's life. This list could go on ad-nauseum.

One of the problems is that there are a lot of people who misuse their sexuality. Unfortunately we, as naturists, have gotten lumped into that category.

Biblical Sex and Sexuality:
Unlike the typical understanding of "Biblical sexuality", which amounts to a long list of do's and don't's, I want to focus on the positive aspects of Biblical sexuality. The Bible does have specific rules and regulations for sexual behavior, but in reality, they pertain to prohibitions against certain illicit activities, such as homosexuality and beastiality, incest and adultery. While we acknowledge these prohibitions, they don't dominate our thinking or our lives.

What about positive Biblical sexuality?
We acknowledge and believe that God is the author and creator of both our bodies and our sexuality (sex). In creating us male and female, God created us sexual beings. He also called the creation of mankind "Very good". As such, we are sexual beings because God intended and created us to be sexual beings. It was not an afterthought. Sexuality is not an invention of the human mind. We also believe that God intended us to procreate and populate His earth, because He said "Be fruitful and multiply". Thus we should be convinced that God is also the author and creator of sex. If God created and blessed it, it must be good. The Bible largely stays out of our bedrooms, in that there are no real prohibitions about what a couple may or may not do sexually.

Sex and sexuality are not things to be swept under the rug, because they are an intimate, God-given part of our lives. As Christian Naturists, we have the opportunity and obligation to be Ambassadors for the truth of God's word, even if our message isn't popular in today's church and society. We must depend on the work of the Holy Spirit to bring the true power to our message, because only He can illuminate dark, closed minds. May God give us grace to be His Ambassadors for truth.

I am naked and unashamed in Christ!

Steve :cross:
1) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 14) And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:1, 1:14
User avatar
pipermac
Native Resident
 
Posts: 245
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:18 pm
Location: Davenport, Florida

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby Petros » Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:09 am

"Social nudity is perceived as sexual liberty and will continue to be condemned by "conservative" Christians. "

Let us not forget, they will be joined by mainstream nonChristians.

The prime issue is deviance. And if people can link a deviation with sexuality or politics without affecting a privileged group - one of the minorities entitled to complain of perceived mistreratment - they ill work to put it down.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
User avatar
Petros
Native Resident
 
Posts: 5276
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 2:01 am
Location: Wisconsin

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby Bare_Truth » Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:38 am

Petros wrote:....... - they ill work to put it down.

-- Good typo?
-- Freudian slip?
-- What you really meant?
It works any of those ways :wink:
I never met anyone that I could not learn something from.
User avatar
Bare_Truth
Native Resident
 
Posts: 2479
Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:07 pm
Location: Ozark Plateau, Southwest Missouri

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby Petros » Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:56 am

Freudian? I have to assume that all typos, whether the proximate cause be mechanical failure, human software glitches, or demonic attac k, happen with God's knowledge and for hios purposes - even "thou shalt commit adultery".

I'm going to attribute that one to the interaction of late night flying fingers wirh a not always ideally arranged and maximally responsive keyboard.

But I do indeed see this human trait as a disease and illness.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
User avatar
Petros
Native Resident
 
Posts: 5276
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 2:01 am
Location: Wisconsin

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby natman » Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:02 pm

There are some really great points being made here.

One that struck my attention was the mention of taking into account "the whole counsel of God". Unfortunately, I have found very few denominations which actually DO look at the entirety of Scripture, at least without running it through a colored lens. It appears that each denomination has their particular bent or focus on certain verses, chapters, books, translations and understandings, many, if not most of which seem to completely gloss over the fact that we are all "made in the image and likeness of God", "naked and unashamed", apart for the application of laws against murder or capital punishment.

I often wonder how most pastors would respond to questions about the acceptance of homosexual couples, or even homosexual "married" couples in church. Of those who see no problem with them, I wonder how they would respond to questions about nudists or naturists in church. Unfortunately, today, I think that more pastors are accepting of homosexuals (something the Bible declares an "abomination") than to nudists or naturists (something that the Bible is completely silent about or even seems to support).

We have to give the gay activists some credit for their tenacity. By continually staying "in your face" for the last thirty years or so, they have successfully changed our society to accept something that was TOTALLY repugnant only a generation ago. However, unlike homosexuality (despite the claims, less than 3% of the population are homosexual), not everyone is homosexual or have homosexual encounters, but EVERYONE gets naked periodically, even if it is only for a brief shower, bath or change of clothing. The only difference is that nudists and naturists prefer to linger in that state for a while longer than many or most.

Another point that struck me is whether we should be evangelists or ambassadors. I would say, why not be both. As evangelists we can (and should) proclaim the truth and good news of Scripture whenever given the opportunity or the challenge. In order to do this, we need to make sure that we KNOW what the Bible does and does not say on a particular topic, including simple, practical, non-sexual nudity. As ambassadors, we live our lives as an example to others in a manner that reflects who we are, Whom we represent, and we do so with boldness and authority of the One Who sent us as His representative.

I am not encouraging anyone to be an "in your face" evangelist or ambassador for Christian naturism. However, I do believe that God has given US a little bit more clarity (at least on this matter) and that we should live our lives according to our understanding, and deal with the consequences when and if they occur. In my case, my wife is far more outspoken about our (mostly my) practice of naturism in and around the house. She has mentioned it to all of our close friends, neighbors and even Sunday School class. This far there has not been a single negative repercussion from any of her comments. I see that as an affirmation that what we are doing is ultimately acceptable. Further, I have had the opportunity to teach the Biblical view of nudity many times to our Sunday School class, also never receiving negative feedback.

I simply recommend that we pray for God to present us with opportunities to discuss the Biblical perspective on the nude human body whenever possible.
SON-cerely,
Nathan Powers

Get exposed to the sun, and get exposed to the Son.
User avatar
natman
Mayor (Site Admin)
 
Posts: 7264
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 3:48 pm
Location: Houston, Texas

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby vycna » Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:44 pm

The consideration of the future of Christian naturism goes right to a discussion of dealing with sexual subjects. But what it involves is really more otherwise, underlying it is the issue individuals have with a surrounding Christian church, with seeing that nudity in living is not open to consideration let alone understanding, but is subject to being judged. If we can just approach the essential thing, obedience to the gospel, that is what is right in response to Christ, and has nothing to do with whether believers are nude among others who are also nude, what matters is faithful living and not compromising what Christian believers should be doing. So nudity itself has no real impact in being Christian, it can be shown, it is just another way life may be lived with that. Many of the Christian church may have objection to this but it can be seen with an honest look that there is no basis for the objections, as far as what is from revelation, with what is real obedience possible. There are more real issues to Christianity itself, are there things being neglected by Christians generally? Is there true living without judgment of others, is there real compassion without arbitrary limits? Is gossip avoided? There is much more in Christ-likeness to grow in.
vycna
Native Resident
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:51 pm

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby jochanaan » Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:36 pm

For several years now I have been hoping that a "critical mass" of Christian naturists would form, forcing the churches to have a serious conversation about social nudity and what the Bible (as opposed to traditions and church dogma) actually says about it. It hasn't happened yet. But maybe 2014 will be the year...
You can live your life in fear--or you can live your life.
User avatar
jochanaan
Councillor
 
Posts: 6342
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:58 pm
Location: Denver

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby bn2bnude » Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:43 pm

I'm adding a couple of resources to my post above here...

Here is an article on "Rethinking Drinking". A sermon given on the Duke campus by the same person is here (45 min).
So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. (Rom 8:1 NLT)



If I speak with the tongues of men and angels but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. (1 Cor 13:1)
User avatar
bn2bnude
Native Resident
 
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2006 8:09 am
Location: Denver

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby pipermac » Mon Dec 30, 2013 11:34 pm

jochanaan wrote:For several years now I have been hoping that a "critical mass" of Christian naturists would form, forcing the churches to have a serious conversation about social nudity and what the Bible (as opposed to traditions and church dogma) actually says about it. It hasn't happened yet. But maybe 2014 will be the year...


I wish we had a "like" button on posts, because this one definitely gets two-thumbs-up. Very well put brother :!:

The other Christian Naturists I have met are also very hesitant about being more open about their naturist activities. Maybe the problem is that there are just too few of us that actually care. Most seem to be content to huddle in their respective caves and go to an established naturist venue once in a while, as long as everyone leaves them alone.

I am naked and unashamed in Christ!

Steve :cross:
1) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 14) And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:1, 1:14
User avatar
pipermac
Native Resident
 
Posts: 245
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:18 pm
Location: Davenport, Florida

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby ezduzit » Tue Dec 31, 2013 7:05 am

Given the political climate we live in I suspect it will become naturism without Christ .
Ez
ezduzit
 

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby bn2bnude » Tue Dec 31, 2013 9:51 am

ezduzit wrote:Given the political climate we live in I suspect it will become naturism without Christ .
Ez


Ez,

While I understand why you might say that, I'd have to argue that it is not necessarily the case.

First, we've not had any true persecution of Christians as a whole in this country. Not until they start locking us away for our beliefs will that be the case. No, I don't consider Phil being suspended from Duck Dynasty persecution. Certainly there are pockets and individual cases, like the bakeries who've refused to make wedding cakes for same sex marriages and have been punished by the courts.

Second, it's almost counter intuitive but it is persecution, not lack of it that makes the true church grow. We are seeing the same phenomena in Islam today. Were the west to have left Islam alone, it would not be spreading at the heightened pace it is now.

Looking at the early church it was the persecution of those who were truly believers that caused others to look and go "There must be something to this".

Once Christianity was made the defacto (or in the case of Rome, the state religion) religion, there was not the same commitment and, I would argue, the concept of "lukewarm" may apply to many.

The US was not really any different. The puritans came to the US because of religious persecution. The same can be said for many other groups... Anabaptists to name one. In the case of the Puritans, once it because the dominate thought, the lack of commitment nearly caused it to die in a few generations.

I'm not saying that I would look forward to persecution but...
So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. (Rom 8:1 NLT)



If I speak with the tongues of men and angels but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. (1 Cor 13:1)
User avatar
bn2bnude
Native Resident
 
Posts: 2712
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2006 8:09 am
Location: Denver

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby Petros » Tue Dec 31, 2013 10:21 am

Arguably, the Church might be more accepting were Christians and naturists both "under cover" [pun intended]. As things are, as long as the church as institution is accepted, the ones who delight in running institutions - who by their nature dislike deviation - WILL run the church.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
User avatar
Petros
Native Resident
 
Posts: 5276
Joined: Thu Aug 26, 2010 2:01 am
Location: Wisconsin

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby jochanaan » Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:46 am

ezduzit wrote:Given the political climate we live in I suspect it will become naturism without Christ .
Ez
Not as long as we're part of it! :D
You can live your life in fear--or you can live your life.
User avatar
jochanaan
Councillor
 
Posts: 6342
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:58 pm
Location: Denver

Re: What is to become of Christian Naturism.

Postby jochanaan » Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:55 am

Petros wrote:Arguably, the Church might be more accepting were Christians and naturists both "under cover" [pun intended]. As things are, as long as the church as institution is accepted, the ones who delight in running institutions - who by their nature dislike deviation - WILL run the church.
Hmmm...Perhaps there is a model for revival here among us Christian naturists. We mostly do not like authorities telling us how to live, especially when they tell us we can't be nude. We are neither an institution nor a hierarchy nor a "staff-command" model; we are a network of independent thinkers who happen to agree on these few points and respect the thoughts, words and deeds of others. We have no infrastructure to speak of (this forum hardly counts!); what binds us is the mutual love of Jesus and His creation, the naked human body. Our rules are few and flexible, based mostly on the Bible and common sense, subject to the guiding Holy Spirit. And there is a warmth and acceptance here that few others know.

Perhaps, instead of a revival of institutions, we will see a growth in both numbers, visibility in the churches, and mutual character.
You can live your life in fear--or you can live your life.
User avatar
jochanaan
Councillor
 
Posts: 6342
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:58 pm
Location: Denver

PreviousNext

Return to What is nudism / naturism?

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests