Is all nudity full of lust?

How do people control their lust, when they are all together, naked? Doesn't the Bible say it's wrong?<P>Only Native Residents may post here.

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Is all nudity full of lust?

Postby LivingFree » Sat May 05, 2007 10:30 pm

I just heard a news blurb on the Fox 10:00 PM news. They were reporting that approximately 400,000 cases of child molestation are reported annually in the USA. I don't know the statistical specifics, but if that is the actual number, and if the US population is approximately 325 million, by my figures that's 1.2 percent of the total US population. Given that half of the population is female, and nearly half is young, that means that between 2% and 4% of the US population are reported as child molesters. That is consistent with other forms of deviant behavior, where "deviant" means different from the way all the rest of us behave.

Granted, even one molestation is one too many, but this puts into perspective what sometimes turns into mob hysteria.

Not every naked person is a child molester!
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Postby Jon-Marc » Sat May 05, 2007 11:29 pm

What has this got to do with all nudity being full of lust? Any nudist/naturist knows, of course, that it is NOT. Lust for me has never been a problem.
The Righteousness of Christ--the ONLY clothing I need.
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Postby Desert Hiker » Sat May 05, 2007 11:55 pm

I know just what you mean there :roll:

I too grow weary of the hysteria surrounding these issues, and the statistics just do not bear witness to the severity that is often eluded to, or implied. It seems like every election cycle, new laws are passed to make life rougher for molestors, and "would be" molestors. Which I agree, that we need to protect our children from harm--but at what point does it cross the line from reasonable protection, to stifling the healthy development of the children, and intruding on the everyday rights of all of us. I know that I am no danger to kids, but I for one, will NEVER apply for a job driving a school bus--all it takes is one kid to make a single false accusation about me, and I would be ruined for life--even though nothing happened.

I have been in many situations that, as I thought about it later, would appear scandalous to many people--especially if taken out of context. For instance, picture a naked 45 year old man, sitting in a hot tub with 3 naked girls, and none of them his wife, and the oldest girl there was 13 :o :shock: --the youngest was 6, and the other 8 :? Yeah--that was me, and before you break out the hand cuffs, ready to string me up from the nearest tree--the 2 younger girls were both my daughters, and the oldest a friend of our family--and my wife, and the older girl's aunt were not far away, and we are all happy naturists --and NO, nothing occured there that I would not be afraid to tell anyone about :roll: None the less, I had you going for a minute there didn't I :wink:
Peace In Christ, Sam

Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked I will depart...--Job
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Postby jochanaan » Sun May 06, 2007 1:18 am

Desert Hiker wrote:...None the less, I had you going for a minute there didn't I :wink:

Not me! I've been in similar situations. :mrgreen:
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Postby Desert Hiker » Sun May 06, 2007 1:49 am

jochanaan wrote:
Desert Hiker wrote:...None the less, I had you going for a minute there didn't I :wink:

Not me! I've been in similar situations. :mrgreen:


Indeed--like I have no doubt that people would assume the worsed, to learn that you and I (a married, over the road truck driver) had dined together, and lounged naked together in your apartment--how quickly would they accuse you and me of having some homosexual affair? :roll:
Peace In Christ, Sam

Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked I will depart...--Job
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Postby jochanaan » Sun May 06, 2007 1:51 pm

Of course, Sam, a different class of people assume that, because David said his soul-brother Jonathan's love for him was better than woman's love, they had to have been homosexual partners. Shows what happens when you ass u me. :lol:
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Postby natman » Mon May 07, 2007 12:52 pm

LF,

I'm trying to understand what an article about child abuse has to do with being naked.

Do you have a link to the story? Who was the presenter?

Thanks



I think that child molestation is a growing problem in the US and needs to be addressed as quickly as possible. However, as a Christian naturist, I do not see what simple nudity has to do with this problem. Instead, I believe that it is more closely tied to the continual message that we humans are nothing more than cosmic accidents, the products of random chance, evolved from slime. Couple that with a lack of moral standards and the proliferation of hard-core pornography which objectizes women and children and it is no wonder that we do not have an even bigger problem, like that which is going on in Indonesia and Russia.
SON-cerely,
Nathan Powers

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Postby jochanaan » Mon May 07, 2007 3:55 pm

LF, was there anything in the article that tried to link family nudism with child abuse? :?:
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Postby LivingFree » Mon May 07, 2007 10:27 pm

natman wrote:I'm trying to understand what an article about child abuse has to do with being naked.

Do you have a link to the story? Who was the presenter?


Sorry, all, It was just a blurb on a Fox nightly news program, and before I got focused it was gone. I guess you could research last night's Fox news casts if you were interested.

Jon-Marc, this has nothing to do with anything, except . . .

All, again, I posted this news bit to try to provoke some new discussion, not the same old tried and true rant against railers on naturists. (I'm speaking in generalities, not making specific accusations.)

Let's put this into perspective. How often do people think in terms of hyperbole -- "all" or "everyone," etc. This news bite shows, again, that abusers are but a very minute portion of the population. Just dwell on that fact for awhile, and rejoice. Don't rant -- just rejoice.

Let's not rail on everyone who wrongfully accuses everyone and everything, as it is sometimes so easy to do. (And in my view naturists are just as guilty of ranting at those who criticize us as the other way around.) But I didn't intend to turn this into a rant -- rather, into a word of encouragement to move beyond it.

So instead, is there a way to use information like this to bring healthy education to the populace? Is there a way to rejoice that "the glass is half full" instead of half empty? Here's one way to begin.

So this sound bite mentioned 400,000 incidents of sexual abuse in a year's time. AANR cites 50,000 members, and their stats show that 19% of the US population has participated in a naturist social event -- or would if they could. Now, go figure. If 2%-4% of the population has been identified as a sexual abuser, but 19% are identified as naturists (and another 20% are private or home nudists), doesn't that begin to light candles in the darkness?

So, does this begin to explain why I posted what I did? Can you take it from there, in a positive, educative vein? Just to be very clear, I was only trying to invite positive comments on some good things in this world -- but I guess I was a bit unclear at the outset. Please forgive me.

(BTW, why is it that the same five or six people post on nearly every topic, and almost no one else does?)
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Postby LivingFree » Mon May 07, 2007 10:32 pm

jochanaan wrote:LF, was there anything in the article that tried to link family nudism with child abuse? :?:


No, not that's I'm aware, joch. But I made the quantum leap that so many people are guilty of, i.e. all nudity is perv. But I made the second quantum lead away from that, to try to lead into a positive, educative converstion. I guess I really bungled that one badly. Again, beg your pardon.
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Postby natman » Tue May 08, 2007 11:21 am

LivingFree wrote:BTW, why is it that the same five or six people post on nearly every topic, and almost no one else does?


I think that the majority of members here are lurking, reading the posts and watching how these conversations unfold. Also, part of the reason is that many of the new members are not up on the facts and are hesitant to voice their own positions on things until they are more sure of themselves.


On this issue(s), even though I am a Christian, I see myself as somewhat of a pragmatist. I have a faith that I feel is based in facts and evidence revealed through God's creation, including the character of man.

You are wanting to look at the small percentage of child molesters per-capita in this nation as a positive. However, I see the growth in the number of cases over the past forty years as a sign that there is something definitely wrong with this nation that claims to be a "Christian" nation, invoking the title of the Creater of the Universe, "God", in it's pledge, on it's currency and on it's monuments.

Looking at other nations where simple nudity is more common and accepted, even with their secular governments, we see an obvious decrease in crimes of this nature as well as other social issues such as teen pregnancy, rape, abortion and spread of STDs. Pragmatically, the most obvious reason for these differences is in the lack of the "Taboo" factor, the removal of the "mystery", and more comfortable and open communication between children and their parents.

I guess what I am saying is that, not only is there a disconnect between simple nudity and child molestation, there is a definite benefit to the acceptance of a society to simple nudity in general. That is part of the message we should be trying to get out. Perhaps it could reverse 160 years of sexual deviancy which I feel is a direct result of man-made Puritanical and Victorian tradition.
SON-cerely,
Nathan Powers

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Postby jochanaan » Tue May 08, 2007 4:22 pm

natman wrote:...Perhaps it could reverse 160 years of sexual deviancy which I feel is a direct result of man-made Puritanical and Victorian tradition.

...which, ironically, was developed in response to actual or perceived sexual deviance. :roll:
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Postby LivingFree » Wed May 09, 2007 12:15 am

natman wrote: You are wanting to look at the small percentage of child molesters per-capita in this nation as a positive. However, I see the growth in the number of cases over the past forty years as a sign that there is something definitely wrong with this nation that claims to be a "Christian" nation, invoking the title of the Creater of the Universe, "God", in it's pledge, on it's currency and on it's monuments.

Looking at other nations where simple nudity is more common and accepted, even with their secular governments, we see an obvious decrease in crimes of this nature as well as other social issues such as teen pregnancy, rape, abortion and spread of STDs. Pragmatically, the most obvious reason for these differences is in the lack of the "Taboo" factor, the removal of the "mystery", and more comfortable and open communication between children and their parents.

I guess what I am saying is that, not only is there a disconnect between simple nudity and child molestation, there is a definite benefit to the acceptance of a society to simple nudity in general. That is part of the message we should be trying to get out. Perhaps it could reverse 160 years of sexual deviancy which I feel is a direct result of man-made Puritanical and Victorian tradition.


I think that part of the "rise" in the insidence of reported crimes has more to do with better law enforement than with a rise in the commissions of crime per se, at least on a per capita basis. But I am also aware of the lower sexual crime rates in countries where ordinary nudity is not such a strong taboo. The actual fact is, removing the taboos actually does reduce the crime rate.

But I did also want to look at the overall picture. 40% of the US population is comfortable with non-sexualized nudity. That up from 0% 80 years ago. Naked people don't commit crimes; perverted minds commit crimes. Our efforts should be directed in the direction of protecting us from the criminal mind, not from the innocent, casual sunbather, nude or otherwise. It is still dangerous for a nudist to be open about his/her preferences, and that's one area of discrimination that needs to be addressed in a positive way.The other is to continue to teach and talk about (demystify) simply, orginary nudity.
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Postby Desert Hiker » Wed May 09, 2007 2:29 am

jochanaan wrote:
natman wrote:...Perhaps it could reverse 160 years of sexual deviancy which I feel is a direct result of man-made Puritanical and Victorian tradition.

...which, ironically, was developed in response to actual or perceived sexual deviance. :roll:


Partly true John--at least that was their "excuse"--I see it more as a scheme by the wealthy, and rich of that era to flaunt their wealth, and opulence. And since they knew that the poor could not afford the trappings of the rich, it would further ensure their perceived superiority by encouraging the poor to go broke trying to emulate them. At the same time, it gave the rich the appearance of proprietary, without actually having to be morally proper. Additionally, by outlawing nudity, they made the least showing of some cleavage all that much more enticing. And those corsets hid a multitude of sins, particularly glutany--they had the appearence of being perfectly formed and morally upright, while they lived a less public life of debauchery, and scandalous affairs.

Oh yes, they were great pretenders--like so many of us.
Peace In Christ, Sam

Naked I came from my mother's womb, and naked I will depart...--Job
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Postby bn2bnude » Wed May 09, 2007 7:25 am

LivingFree wrote:(BTW, why is it that the same five or six people post on nearly every topic, and almost no one else does?)


In my case, there are a couple of reasons.

1) If I have no opinion, I'll not post.
2) If I have an opinion and it is controversial, I'll wait some time before replying to give it some thought rather than an emotional response.
3) If someone has already mentioned the same thing I would have, I won't 'pile on'
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