Lust

How do people control their lust, when they are all together, naked? Doesn't the Bible say it's wrong?<P>Only Native Residents may post here.

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Lust

Postby ihaveel » Mon Aug 06, 2012 10:05 pm

I suspect this post should go into the section on "The Lust Factor", but for some reason it does not give me access to post there, even though I am now considered a "native resident". Here goes....

It seems to me from what I've read and experienced that lust really comes from within the mind and heart of the observer rather than from the person being observed, unless the observed person is purposely trying to project a sensual image. Even then, the primary lust is the responsibility of the observer. The observer has the responsibility to deal with his own heart and mind on the issue and decide to break off all lusting that is not for his/her own spouse. Sexual stimulation may be there, and that is natural. But the lusting or craving or desiring to have the person as a sexual partner does not necessarily follow the initial sexual stimulation brought on by an immediate response to sight.

Thus, a person can learn to control his own lust whether in a clothed community or unclothed community. Never having been in an unclothed environment of mixed sexes, I can't speak to this issue. But many of you have, and you have testified over and over again that the lust factor greatly diminishes or even disappears in such a setting. I will gladly take your word for it until such time as the Lord may lead me into an unclothed mixed gender setting. However, I think each of us living in a primarily clothed environment can make the same decision in regard to lust as a person who experiences mixed nudity. It just may be harder to do. But nonetheless the responsibility is still ours.

Blessings,

ihaveel
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Re: Lust

Postby JimShedd112 » Tue Aug 07, 2012 12:36 am

Ihaveel,

I agree the one looking upon another is the one primarily responsible for his or her lust. As you pointed out if the one being viewed purposely provokes the observer then he/she shares some responsiblity. Still, it is the responsibilty of the observer to control his/her lust, whatever it may require. I suppose some might make the claim "The devil made me do it" but I'm not sure it'd be a legitimate argument.

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Re: Lust

Postby Larryk1052 » Tue Aug 07, 2012 7:20 am

I think you understand where lust comes from..
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"Nude" just means barefoot all over.
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Re: Lust

Postby bn2bnude » Tue Aug 07, 2012 7:39 am

ihaveel wrote:It seems to me from what I've read and experienced that lust really comes from within the mind and heart of the observer rather than from the person being observed, unless the observed person is purposely trying to project a sensual image. Even then, the primary lust is the responsibility of the observer. The observer has the responsibility to deal with his own heart and mind on the issue and decide to break off all lusting that is not for his/her own spouse. Sexual stimulation may be there, and that is natural. But the lusting or craving or desiring to have the person as a sexual partner does not necessarily follow the initial sexual stimulation brought on by an immediate response to sight.

Thus, a person can learn to control his own lust whether in a clothed community or unclothed community. Never having been in an unclothed environment of mixed sexes, I can't speak to this issue. But many of you have, and you have testified over and over again that the lust factor greatly diminishes or even disappears in such a setting. I will gladly take your word for it until such time as the Lord may lead me into an unclothed mixed gender setting. However, I think each of us living in a primarily clothed environment can make the same decision in regard to lust as a person who experiences mixed nudity. It just may be harder to do. But nonetheless the responsibility is still ours.

Blessings,

ihaveel



I think you have discovered something that many of us here know either consciously or intuitively. It is also something that many in the Church seem to have forgotten.

I say that because I often see girls blamed for "inciting lust" in the boys by the way they dress. As you state, it doesn't mean they are not arousing the boys (is that different?). Rather than training the girls how to dress, maybe we need to train the boys how to think?
So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. (Rom 8:1 NLT)



If I speak with the tongues of men and angels but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. (1 Cor 13:1)
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Re: Lust

Postby Ramblinman » Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:21 am

ihaveel wrote:It seems to me from what I've read and experienced that lust really comes from within the mind and heart of the observer rather than from the person being observed, unless the observed person is purposely trying to project a sensual image. Even then, the primary lust is the responsibility of the observer. The observer has the responsibility to deal with his own heart and mind on the issue and decide to break off all lusting that is not for his/her own spouse. Sexual stimulation may be there, and that is natural. But the lusting or craving or desiring to have the person as a sexual partner does not necessarily follow the initial sexual stimulation brought on by an immediate response to sight.

Thus, a person can learn to control his own lust whether in a clothed community or unclothed community. Never having been in an unclothed environment of mixed sexes, I can't speak to this issue. But many of you have, and you have testified over and over again that the lust factor greatly diminishes or even disappears in such a setting. I will gladly take your word for it until such time as the Lord may lead me into an unclothed mixed gender setting. However, I think each of us living in a primarily clothed environment can make the same decision in regard to lust as a person who experiences mixed nudity. It just may be harder to do. But nonetheless the responsibility is still ours.

Blessings,

ihaveel


If you take your family for a holiday on the beach, (and it need not be a nude beach) you will see people in a state of near nudity. If you live in a cold climate and it's been a long winter, chances are, you are not accustomed to seeing that much skin.

Most likely none of the men and not all the women will quicken your pulse. But yes, there will be some women in the prime of their life whose beauty who will inspire you to awe and a certain degree of excitement.

After a few days, you still notice the cuties, but your mind calms down and they are not quite as distracting. It's like that at nudist camps, resorts and nude beaches as well. The same way you get used to semi-nudity after several days on the textile beach, you will grow accustomed to total nudity.
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Re: Lust

Postby Ramblinman » Tue Aug 07, 2012 11:25 am

bn2bnude wrote:...Rather than training the girls how to dress, maybe we need to train the boys how to think?


I agree, but social nudity is such an effective tool in child rearing, both for female self-image and to teach boys to respect women and address the natural curiosity that boys and girls both have, why not use this powerful tool available to parents?

Most don't know it. In fact, the common wisdom is that prudishness and lack of exposure to nudity is a virtue.
And we all see how ineffectual this strategy is.
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Re: Lust

Postby natman » Tue Aug 07, 2012 3:34 pm

bn2bnude wrote:I think you have discovered something that many of us here know either consciously or intuitively. It is also something that many in the Church seem to have forgotten.


Joel, I don't think the Church has forgotten it. I think the Church has generally bought in the lie of Victorian Prudery and is actually TEACHING it to it's members.

bn2bnude wrote:Rather than training the girls how to dress, maybe we need to train the boys how to think?


I agree. "Lust" is NOT just about girls. It can involve a strong desire to have anything that does not belong to you or is not intended by God to belong to you. We need to teach our kids (boys AND girls) how to see ALL things, members of the opposite sex, clothed or nude, cars, houses, jobs, money, etc. through the eyes of God.
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Re: Lust

Postby jochanaan » Tue Aug 07, 2012 5:02 pm

(Councillor's Note: I moved the topic to its intended forum. ihaveel, if you still have trouble, send our Sheriff a private message.)


I think he's got it! :D And isn't it a freeing thing, ihaveel, to realize that we CAN control our thoughts with God's help and that we don't have to worry about what might happen if we see "more than we should"? Truly, I have found that regularly gathering with naked friends is a powerful deterrent to the world's way of thinking about lust etc. 8) May God lead you soon to experience this. There's nothing quite like it this side of Heaven. :)
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Re: Lust

Postby prairieboy » Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:00 am

James 1

13Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God; for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempteth no man:

14but each man is tempted, when he is drawn away by his own lust, and enticed.

15Then the lust, when it hath conceived, beareth sin: and the sin, when it is fullgrown, bringeth forth death.
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Re: Lust

Postby Jon-Marc » Sat Aug 11, 2012 7:38 pm

Just as "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder"--so is lust. Lust is not caused by someone being nude, it grows in the mind and imagination of the one who is lusting after someone else. Also, lust can happen (and often does) even when the observed and observer are both fully dressed. Maybe I'm in a minority, but lust has never been a problem for me--maybe because of my very low sex drive even when I was young.
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Re: Lust

Postby jochanaan » Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:39 am

Jon-Marc wrote:...Maybe I'm in a minority, but lust has never been a problem for me--maybe because of my very low sex drive even when I was young.
It hasn't been much of a problem with me either, and my drives seem as strong as anyone's. It's not in the drives--it's in our love for God and understanding of the "issues." ;) A wise college professor at my alma mater once taught in his class that lust is neither normal curiosity, nor appreciation of beauty, nor simple sexual desire, nor even the wish for friendship or touch, but rather an inordinate, consciously fed wish to possess someone or something that is not yours. That teaching has saved me much unneeded guilt over the decades. 8)
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Re: Lust

Postby bn2bnude » Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:55 am

natman wrote:
bn2bnude wrote:I think you have discovered something that many of us here know either consciously or intuitively. It is also something that many in the Church seem to have forgotten.


Joel, I don't think the Church has forgotten it. I think the Church has generally bought in the lie of Victorian Prudery and is actually TEACHING it to it's members.

I can agree with that... It's a matter of semantics.

bn2bnude wrote:Rather than training the girls how to dress, maybe we need to train the boys how to think?


natman wrote:I agree. "Lust" is NOT just about girls. It can involve a strong desire to have anything that does not belong to you or is not intended by God to belong to you. We need to teach our kids (boys AND girls) how to see ALL things, members of the opposite sex, clothed or nude, cars, houses, jobs, money, etc. through the eyes of God.

Very true.

Again, another truth that has often been displaced (forgotten?) in our churches. We are so concerned about SEX as if it is the only real sin in the world, all others pale in comparison. The comment I hear frequently is about the preacher who comes down hard on "sex, drugs and 'Rock and Roll'" and goes out and acts as a glutton (or worse in some cases).
So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. (Rom 8:1 NLT)



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Re: Lust

Postby MtnDewNudist » Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:35 pm

As has been stated lust is merely coveting what we should not have or should not desire, and I do remember that being one of the Ten Commandments.

I grew up in a rather prudish home, I was taught that we should cover our bodies at all times. Seeing someone of the opposite gender was not something that I experienced. Yes I saw my younger sisters when they were babies (changed their diapers) and such but by the time they hit their toddler years that diminished greatly and then did not happen. By the time I was in my teens I had a great curiosity about the opposite gender. I had seen other boys my age nude in the locker room and occasionally men but other than that was not generally exposed to nudity. Now as the internet was not available for me growing up (thank goodness for that) I did not have any real exposure to pornography and again was limited in what I could see. ONce I got older and eventually married I discovered the female form and have a voracious curiosity which led to many questions and discussions with my wife. I still had a curiosity about females in general as to what differences might be and how my wife might compare. Eventually I teetered on the edge of pornography a couple of times before I almost fell in. I guess you might say I was sliding down the abyss when somehow I caught myself and was able to pull back. I found that I had a struggle for some time afterwards as I fought the impulse to seek out pornography. I also found myself looking at other women (fully clothed) and wondering what they actually looked like or mentally undressing them. I was fighting lust. Now this was having grown up in the most 'prudish' of manners and thus by common reasoning I should have been immune to such things, but instead I was fighting them and about to loose the fight.

It was about this time that I started some soul searching and working through some other issues found my way into the naturist sights. As I began to examine naturism and the concept that nude does not equal sexual I started to wonder if it was possible to be free of lust. Eventually after a lot of study and prayer I realized that there was nothing wrong with naturism and started to accept and embrace naturism. As a result I found that my fight with lust diminished and then I realized that I could actually be responsible and ultimately control my own thoughts, something that I had always been taught at church, but never quite grasped and I seriously doubt that most who do teach that in church can even fully grasp it. I now find lust to be much less of a problem and many of the things that previously were 'enticing' for me have no sway over me.

I have not had any real experience with social nudity other than one visit to Hippie Hollow last year but I found it was not a sexually charges situation. While I still had some degree of curiosity about others I was not driven by lust at all.
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Re: Lust

Postby JimShedd112 » Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:06 am

The very few times I've been in mixed nudist company I was also curious but not in the least controlled by lust. Like you MtnDewNaturist, I find myself more lustful when viewing a clothed or partially clothed female versus full nudity unless looking at porn.

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Re: Lust

Postby Jon-Marc » Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:28 pm

I don't suppose that textiles and nudists/naturists will ever agree on what causes lust--whether it's the skimpy, sexually revealing clothing and swimsuits that many women wear, or total nudity. Total nudity takes away the curiosity and mystery as to what she looks like totally nude. I used to look at women years ago (before getting into social nudity) and wondered what she looked like nude. It had nothing to do with wanting her; it had to do with curiosity as to what was hidden (which often isn't much), and did it look as good as what I could see.
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