Death sentence for being a Christian

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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby Petros » Fri May 16, 2014 2:18 am

The Sudan has always been a harsh place. Definitely mored polarized than when we were there - the splitting off of the south may have contributed.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby natman » Fri May 16, 2014 7:00 am

And THIS is they type of law (Sharia) that they have been trying to introduce in Detroit and Florida. :?

I can see this happening in countries where women and minorities are already oppressed, but cannot even imagine it happening here in the west.
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby ezduzit » Fri May 16, 2014 7:14 am

natman wrote:And THIS is they type of law (Sharia) that they have been trying to introduce in Detroit and Florida. :?

I can see this happening in countries where women and minorities are already oppressed, but cannot even imagine it happening here in the west.



It really depends on who is elected to office ie those in authority over us .
It could well be a case of the minority ruling over the majority.
Ez
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby bn2bnude » Fri May 16, 2014 7:36 am

If you look at history, there is a long tradition of persecuting believers.

Of course we realize the persecution between Pentecost and when Constantine legalized Christianity in Rome. It's fairly well documented in Fox's Book of Martyrs.

The church in the middle ages was not above persecuting people who thought differently than they did either. I was trying to find the reference but, of course, couldn't. There is a town in France where 10's of thousands of people were killed as the church at the time tried to bring their beliefs back into line with the thinking at the time. That said, there isn't much known about those that were being persecuted so maybe they weren't really "Christian" in our sense.

Anabaptists have been persecuted by others in Europe until more recent times. I remember hearing of one of the anabaptists who was being chased by the local law enforcement who fell through the ice. Putting his faith into practice, he went back and rescued the man. The official promptly arrested the man where he was burned.

If you read a more recent "Foxes" type book -- "Jesus Freaks", you'll see that persecution has far from wained. We just don't hear about it as often.

The other end of this scale is when persecution happens, the church seems to thrive.

China has been persecuting Christians for many years. I've recently heard rumors that they intend to send 1M missionaries to other parts of the asian continent. (I am being purposefully vague)
So now there is no condemnation for those who belong to Christ Jesus. (Rom 8:1 NLT)



If I speak with the tongues of men and angels but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. (1 Cor 13:1)
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby ezduzit » Fri May 16, 2014 7:46 am

bn2bnude wrote:If you look at history, there is a long tradition of persecuting believers.

Of course we realize the persecution between Pentecost and when Constantine legalized Christianity in Rome. It's fairly well documented in Fox's Book of Martyrs.

The church in the middle ages was not above persecuting people who thought differently than they did either. I was trying to find the reference but, of course, couldn't. There is a town in France where 10's of thousands of people were killed as the church at the time tried to bring their beliefs back into line with the thinking at the time. That said, there isn't much known about those that were being persecuted so maybe they weren't really "Christian" in our sense.

Anabaptists have been persecuted by others in Europe until more recent times. I remember hearing of one of the anabaptists who was being chased by the local law enforcement who fell through the ice. Putting his faith into practice, he went back and rescued the man. The official promptly arrested the man where he was burned.

If you read a more recent "Foxes" type book -- "Jesus Freaks", you'll see that persecution has far from wained. We just don't hear about it as often.

The other end of this scale is when persecution happens, the church seems to thrive.

China has been persecuting Christians for many years. I've recently heard rumors that they intend to send 1M missionaries to other parts of the asian continent. (I am being purposefully vague)



Those doing the persecution weren`t Christians
1 John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Ez
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby ezduzit » Fri May 16, 2014 8:06 am

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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby Petros » Fri May 16, 2014 8:49 am

"Those doing the persecution weren`t Christians"

For certains lines of this sort merely give a flush of triumph - typical hypocrisy.

It is important to remember that one can as easily claim

"real (Muslims / Buddhists / Mormons / Jains / linguists / scientists / Samoyeds / Murgatroyds) do not not do such things.

For many "Christian" simply means one who is identified by himself or Christians or any atheist who happens along as a Christian.

Only ONE can reliably apply the "I never knew you" standard.

Same way, one may say - in vain - no genuine naturist would do what some unclothed people do.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby ezduzit » Fri May 16, 2014 11:02 am

Petros wrote:"Those doing the persecution weren`t Christians"

For certains lines of this sort merely give a flush of triumph - typical hypocrisy.

It is important to remember that one can as easily claim

"real (Muslims / Buddhists / Mormons / Jains / linguists / scientists / Samoyeds / Murgatroyds) do not not do such things.

For many "Christian" simply means one who is identified by himself or Christians or any atheist who happens along as a Christian.

Only ONE can reliably apply the "I never knew you" standard.

Same way, one may say - in vain - no genuine naturist would do what some unclothed people do.


Do I understand you correctly ?
Are you saying those who persecute / kill in the name of God are Christians ie born again ie saved ?

Ez
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby jasenj1 » Fri May 16, 2014 3:24 pm

ezduzit wrote:Do I understand you correctly ?
Are you saying those who persecute / kill in the name of God are Christians ie born again ie saved ?

In the time period being discussed - the Middle Ages - yes, I think many who killed others as heretics, witches, etc. were Christians. Born-again, Holy Spirit indwelled, headed for heaven Christians. And I suspect they killed many Christians, too.

Many likely weren't on both sides, but many were. Only God has the final say on which were which.

- Jasen.

P.S. Hmmm... BBCode is off for me again.
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby natman » Fri May 16, 2014 4:37 pm

jasenj1 wrote:P.S. Hmmm... BBCode is off for me again.


I noticed and fixed the post.

I have yet to figure out why it seems to pick on you... and only you. :argh:
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby ezduzit » Fri May 16, 2014 5:01 pm

Christians don`t kill Christians.................
Ez

1 John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
ezduzit
 

Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby ezduzit » Fri May 16, 2014 5:08 pm

Petros wrote:"Those doing the persecution weren`t Christians"

For certains lines of this sort merely give a flush of triumph - typical hypocrisy.

It is important to remember that one can as easily claim

"real (Muslims / Buddhists / Mormons / Jains / linguists / scientists / Samoyeds / Murgatroyds) do not not do such things.

For many "Christian" simply means one who is identified by himself or Christians or any atheist who happens along as a Christian.

Only ONE can reliably apply the "I never knew you" standard.

Same way, one may say - in vain - no genuine naturist would do what some unclothed people do.



I find it very offensive being compared to a Muslim, Buddhist , hypocrite , etc, etc............ We serve a risen Saviour
Ez
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby Petros » Sat May 17, 2014 12:26 am

"I find it very offensive being compared to a Muslim, Buddhist , hypocrite , etc, etc............ We serve a risen Saviour
Ez"

No doubt you do. I do not blame you - and did not so compare you. Or myself.

I was pointing out that there are those who count themselves or are counted by others as Christians, engineers, Sikhs, historians, etc. and are not by certain standards.

As of course there are those who are NOT so counted [as some have counted me no linguist] who by those standards are.

The point is there is a higher standard than attribution. Unlike some who have appeared on these pages, I have no grounds for assuming that any one of us here is not a sibling in Christ.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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Re: Death sentence for being a Christian

Postby Petros » Sat May 17, 2014 12:34 am

jasenj1 wrote:
ezduzit wrote:Do I understand you correctly ?
Are you saying those who persecute / kill in the name of God are Christians ie born again ie saved ?

In the time period being discussed - the Middle Ages - yes, I think many who killed others as heretics, witches, etc. were Christians. Born-again, Holy Spirit indwelled, headed for heaven Christians. And I suspect they killed many Christians, too.

Many likely weren't on both sides, but many were. Only God has the final say on which were which.

- Jasen.


P.S. Hmmm... BBCode is off for me again.


ezduzit : no, that is not at all what I was saying. I am inclined to believe that slaughter in the name of Christ is prima facie evidence that the one slaughering is not right with God at the time of the event.

On the other hand, jasenji correctly points out that Christians in the Church Militant are NOT normally perfected and DO sin - of which I must admit I am a clear example [though I have not slaughtered anyone]. And of course one who is NOT a Christian may become a Christian after any number of heinous actions [we will sing Amazing Grace at this point].
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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